I had a discussion with somebody elsewhere who was questioning the version with 10 mins between shots at 3:08 and bangs(cricket bat) at 3:17. That does seem like a long time, but although around 3:17 is set by phone times, the 3:08 does have "wiggle room"
Christo Menelou says 3:08 (yet to testify), but Stipps merely said "about 10 minutes", so maybe it was a little less than 10 minutes?
The person I was in discussion with estimated:
Quote:
Feel like i've been generous with these times
From last shot back to bedroom- 30 seconds
Goes back to bathroom and finds toilet door is locked "rushed back to bedroom"- 45 seconds
opens balcony doors and shouts for help,puts legs on, runs to bathroom kicks door- 2 minutes 30 seconds.
Back to bedroom gets bat, back to bathroom 30 seconds.
So personally i feel he would have been back at the toilet door with the bat in around 4 minutes 15 seconds.
Don't think that's an unreasonable estimate.
My reply:
Quote:
Ok I'll go along with your time for the sake of the argument (Discussion).
After doing that OP was then confronted with the state of Reeva in the toilet...perhaps stunned for a short time? He dragged her body out to bathroom to try and assist. That may have used up several minutes? But lets say just 2 minutes.
So with the time you estimate plus the 2 minute that is a total of 6:15 minutes.
THAT contradicts the State timeline... absolutely
Phone call records put time that Burger and Stipp heard bangs at 3:17 (actually a little after) if you add the 6:15 it would have been 6:23+ before OP could possibly have made his first phone call. Yet he made that call at 3:19
The State contention that the shots were at 3:17 simply does leave time to do much of anything before 3:19 when OP made the call. IMO the shots HAD to be earlier than 3:17.
Working the calculation back from the phone call at 3:19..... take off the 6 minutes and 15 seconds and the shots would have been at 3:12:45.
I do not want to labor the point but that is nowhere near the State version of 3:17 and it is getting closer to what Stipp reported as the first set of bangs.
I am convinced in my mind that Stipp heard bangs that were shots first, and then at around 3:17 he heard bat on door. That is also what burger(s) heard... Bat on door.
I would go further and say, the estimates of time it took OP could be off (too short) I would not be surprised if at times he just paused inactive, or pinged about going one way, then the other. Also, as mentioned, Stipp was not being precise with his "10 minutes" estimate.
So I think it is absolutely clear that Stipp heard gunshots at around 3:10 and then bat on door at 3:17. NO DOUBT in my mind at all. No doubt in my mind that Burger heard OP screaming (like a woman) and the cricket bat bangs at 3:17.
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