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PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2013 7:02 pm 
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MJW wrote:
So far, the DCA hasn't said whether Crump will be allowed to respond. Backwell cites Towers v. City of Longwood, 960 So. 2d 845 (Fla. 5th DCA 2007), where a third-party was allowed to respond in similar circumstances. But that was a civil case, where parties are allowed to intervene for limited purposes to protect their interests. I've tried (within my limited abilities) to find a similar example in a Florida criminal case, but couldn't. I also suspect that it hasn't happened too often in civil cases, or Blackwell would have chosen a different case to cite. Towers seems to me to be very favorable to the defense's position on granting certiorari when a deposition isn't allowed.

Crump's motion to respond was unopposed, and there's certainly an argument that the party who's most affected should have a say. On the other hand, it doesn't seem to be specifically allowed by the appellate rules, and Crump's work-product arguments are already part of the trial court record, and were include in the defense's appendix. Even if Crump is allowed to respond to the work-product argument, I don't think he should be permitted to argue on whether the petition should be dismissed because of the availability of post-judgement appeal.



I think that Crump's continued interference with discovery in the criminal case, by pretending that the law applicable to civil cases applies, and by moving to intervene in the appeal, actually helps the defense. The time is now ripe for the defense to reply along the lines of your prior observation as to the different sources (criminal vs civil rules - absence of common law privilege in Florida) of attorney work product protection in civil and criminal cases and the fundamental constitutional rights of a criminal defendant trumping Crump's purported privilege.


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PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2013 11:39 pm 
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MJW wrote:
So far, the DCA hasn't said whether Crump will be allowed to respond. Backwell cites Towers v. City of Longwood, 960 So. 2d 845 (Fla. 5th DCA 2007), where a third-party was allowed to respond in similar circumstances. But that was a civil case, where parties are allowed to intervene for limited purposes to protect their interests. I've tried (within my limited abilities) to find a similar example in a Florida criminal case, but couldn't. I also suspect that it hasn't happened too often in civil cases, or Blackwell would have chosen a different case to cite. Towers seems to me to be very favorable to the defense's position on granting certiorari when a deposition isn't allowed.

Crump's motion to respond was unopposed, and there's certainly an argument that the party who's most affected should have a say. On the other hand, it doesn't seem to be specifically allowed by the appellate rules, and Crump's work-product arguments are already part of the trial court record, and were include in the defense's appendix. Even if Crump is allowed to respond to the work-product argument, I don't think he should be permitted to argue on whether the petition should be dismissed because of the availability of post-judgement appeal.


This is an excellent post. You sound well educated in the law.


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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 1:19 am 
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Just a tiny reminder...

Thuper Thecret Thread My Arse!

:86

Smooches! DFH

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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 1:27 am 
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Thanks Deb ;)

"Rumpole's mole" approves this message :lol

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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 1:28 am 
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Just a heads-up that Mike McDaniel has done an awesome dissection of the recent court hearing, on his Stately McDaniel Manor blog (http://statelymcdanielmanor.wordpress.com/2013/05/05/the-trayvon-martin-case-update-27-i-forgot-about-it/). Good, meaty stuff there.


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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 1:29 am 
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Thanks LMF... Quite comprehensive... good stuff from Mike McDaniel

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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 1:51 am 
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Mike Mc is always a good read for the Zimmerman case. I will read it tomorrow, Thanks for the link.


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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 2:41 am 
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Thanks to Sundance at CTH for link......................


Robert Zimmerman Jr. interview with Max Tucci on LA Talk Radio May 5 2013


Audio
https://soundcloud.com/coreshift/robert ... i-20130505

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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 9:34 am 
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Another new document at gzlegal:

MOTION FOR EVIDENTIARY HEARING REGARDING ADMISSIBILITY OF EXPERT OPINION TESTIMONY


http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0513/mo ... earing.pdf


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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 9:46 am 
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mooney1el wrote:
Another new document at gzlegal:

MOTION FOR EVIDENTIARY HEARING REGARDING ADMISSIBILITY OF EXPERT OPINION TESTIMONY

http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0513/mo ... earing.pdf


And BOOM go the wanna-be "experts".

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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 10:02 am 
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You mean "I listened to it and is sounds like a kid" isn't scientific?


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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 10:06 am 
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mung wrote:
You mean "I listened to it and is sounds like a kid" isn't scientific?


Let's just say: I look forward to hearing him explain the aural calibration procedure for his ears - or, failing that, the normalization procedure for his ears, considering the absence of voice samples for the parties involved.

(I suspect that he knows his testimony will not be admissible; that's why he already recanted.)

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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 11:22 am 
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OT but related: just one punch, no visible injuries - victim died
http://www.freep.com/article/20130505/S ... dies-punch

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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 11:25 am 
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Quote:
In a new motion, defense attorney Mark O'Mara wrote that those unnamed experts may be using phony science


OS is fabricating stuff. O'Mara made no allegations regarding "phony science" but rather merely asked the Court to set a Frye hearing to evaluate whether the state's voice experts are using reliable methodologies that are generally accepted in the scientific community.

If Nelson continues the policy of ruling in favor of the state, she may lend the magic software salesman a much desired aura of credibility, at least until the DCA reverses such determination on appeal.


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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 11:31 am 
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April 30 minutes, Nelson: "Court does not find there has not been a discovery violation"

And we will much about that be committed.


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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 11:41 am 
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John_Galt wrote:
OS is fabricating stuff. O'Mara made no allegations regarding "phony science" but rather merely asked the Court to set a Frye hearing to evaluate whether the state's voice experts are using reliable methodologies that are generally accepted in the scientific community.

If Nelson continues the policy of ruling in favor of the state, she may lend the magic software salesman a much desired aura of credibility, at least until the DCA reverses such determination on appeal.


I've always wondered if and when there would be a Frye Test hearing since I saw the following stated in an article on CNN when some were questioning the "voice experts" conclusions on the 911 call screams for help.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/03/justice/f ... n-shooting

Quote:
"It really depends on the individual judge," Hostin said. "In Florida, they are going to conduct a Frye test, the legal test, which asks if the science is generally accepted in the community."


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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 12:05 pm 
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I'm getting worried. I seem to be having trouble getting back into this case. Message boards seem to be getting so out of control over a simple self defense case. I am glad this message board is here to get a proper perspective. I am reading here only.

I am throwing my hands up at every other board.

I do go to the Crime Library message board because there are only a few posters there and the discussion moves slow. A lot of the crazies from JQ did come over at first to jump on us, but found it to boring. There are both sides represented there and a moderator who is normal. Most of the JQ crazies are registered there and have been since IS. They registered on both boards at the time.


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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 12:39 pm 
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John_Galt wrote:
April 30 minutes, Nelson: "Court does not find there has not been a discovery violation"

And we will much about that be committed.


I had to read that twice.

Isn't the purpose of a Richardson hearing supposed to be to make a finding for or against discovery violations? Unless that's a typo, is Nelson actually saying that her finding is that the court is not making a finding?

Is this still actually a court? Or has this actually now devolved into the moot court we held in high school literature class, during the study of The Brothers Karamazov?

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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 1:21 pm 
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This sad event sure disproves the Traybots theory that George's nose and head wounds were bo-boos and of no consequence. This reenforces George's claim of self defense when he shot Martin.
Any chance prosecution biased Nelson can be removed from the case?
I like O'Mara West challanging the prosecution "experts". Can't the Feds do something with Martin's "what" at the 7-11 and George's meek voice?


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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 4:24 pm 
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chipbennett wrote:
I had to read that twice.

Isn't the purpose of a Richardson hearing supposed to be to make a finding for or against discovery violations? Unless that's a typo, is Nelson actually saying that her finding is that the court is not making a finding?

Is this still actually a court? Or has this actually now devolved into the moot court we held in high school literature class, during the study of The Brothers Karamazov?


Her grammar teacher needs to slap her upside the head with an English Lit and Composition text book. Double Negatives?


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