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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 3:09 pm 
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Rumpole wrote:
I don't think it is too sinister.. on other pages it highlights what is clearly typed text.. mises ot signature... so I think it is TRYING to auto detect typed text.. but stuffed up with those few blocks :)


But...
I do think detailed analysis can only be done properly on the original document itself.. or at the very least a first generation photo of it.

MOM would need a document expert to inspect the document... not sure he has time for that.

That's one big problem I always have is making sure the document is the original. If MOM would like to send me the original I would gladly look at it.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 3:58 pm 
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Someone at another site noted the comma in the date. Interesting that it's locked, i.e., possibly altered.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 4:03 pm 
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Remember, in context with her letter....Omara had a while back asked for security video from another apartment complex...along with sams and kohls.
So now we kinda have 2 people seeming to be possibly placing trayvon in another location during his hurry home to finish the game. I think Omara has video of trayvon in the complex shes talking about.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 4:07 pm 
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menostupid wrote:
Several news stations have been reporting on BDLRs rant. WFTVs Bill Shaffer & Fox35s Diana Tennis have made some pretty funny comments. DT said something like it sounded as if it was written at 2am while drunk LOL :lol LOVE some of the things DT says


"it sounded as if it was written at 2am while drunk."

I've had SUCH a good laugh over this quote, thanks for bringing it here. That BDLR rant is something else - the most unprofessional, rude, sarcastic and insulting piece of garbage I have ever seen submitted by a "professional."


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 4:10 pm 
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flgirl543 wrote:
My guess is MOM became aware of DD's letter during her depo. BDLR had no choice but to include it in the last discovery dump. I question what was his point in including it his response. Did he think somehow it would be lost among his rant?

D-Man's analysis of the timing posted by Rumpole upthread only confirms what you are saying here and it makes total sense. This case is so screwed up with lies and dirty moves that now everything is suspect!


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 4:31 pm 
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flareon wrote:

It's too bad for her that any normal person would have found "this tragic story" that very night.

No one could have heard what she claims she heard and not try to do something that night ... and they certainly wouldn't have to wait until approached by someone (after the 911 tapes and other information was released) to realize that they was the last person to talk to him alive.

It certainly wasn't "tragic" enough for DD. Nor does it seem she was even "close" enough to "Trevon" to even care. Just another fight.
At the very BEST, we could chalk DD's lack of concern up to a rough upbringing, being surrounded by these kinds of rough events
and viewing them as par for the course. But given the pattern that's been uncovered, the level of deceit and lies going on with Crump and the rest in this case, the worst this could be (and probably is) that most of the DD story is a huge fabrication.

It infuriates me that the whole arrest was based on a foundation of lies and deceit.

(btw, good to see you! :heart )


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 4:34 pm 
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IAmGeorgeZimmerman wrote:
Remember, in context with her letter....Omara had a while back asked for security video from another apartment complex...along with sams and kohls.
So now we kinda have 2 people seeming to be possibly placing trayvon in another location during his hurry home to finish the game. I think Omara has video of trayvon in the complex shes talking about.

Seems there was talk of Trayvon "looking into cars" while in this other complex? Don't want to spread false information, but at this point, it's hard to separate fact from fiction regarding this case. :95


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 4:54 pm 
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concerning W8 letter

The letter is likely what it is portrayed to be. A statement written by W8, prior to the Crump interview. The date and sign off added at the completion of the text. My comment from elsewhere -

Quote:
Assuming that the letter was written prior to W8 telephone (cough) “oral affidavit” interview by Crump, you can say that this letter represents the state of her mind at that point in time (when the letter was written).

This would mean that a lot of extraneous information that W8 may have learned from the media, from Tracy, from Sybrina, from one of Crump’s associates, from Gutman, from Crump etc, did not impact on her writing of this statement.

Her lack of concern after losing phone contact with TM when combined with this letter allows for speculation that she wasn’t that close to TM. [Some of the questions the MOM probably got an answer to, in the shortened deposition session, was “when” and “how” she learned of TM’s death and “what” she did in reaction to that.

Bear in mind that all of the information that Sybrina learned about the tragedy was second and third hand hearsay. Both Tracy and Sybrina, understandably, when hit with this tragedy would search for the most positive interpretation of events, which necessitated a most negative interpretation of GZ’s actions beginning with the fact that GZ was older and armed, and TM was younger and unarmed.

Both Tracy and Sybrina spoke w/W8 prior to the Crump interview. They would have a lot of questions. A lot of the questions would certainly involve whether she could confirm details that they had learned via hearsay – hearsay that may itself been influenced by what they wanted to hear and discounting that which they did not want to hear.

By asking W8 for confirmation of details, W8 “learns” of “facts” and eventually more “facts” as the Crump/Julison narrative gets up and running. In response, Tracy and Sybrina (likely independently) receive confirmation (in their minds) of certain factors from talking to W8. The “confirmation” then become corroboration in their minds and is relayed as such to Crump who has his own agenda running.

The Crump interview now imprints her memory with a suggested narrative (suggested through the repeated emphasis on certain points and recitation of those points).

W8 has lied to Sybrina about the hospital business and likely gave further false confirmation in response to Sybrina’s questions, which then simply affirmed the preconceptions that Sybrina already had.

BDLR’s rhetorical flourishes are amusing, but his statement-taking is an abomination. Basic investigative procedures are designed to avoid almost everything that BDLR did with W8. In order to get at what a witness truly knows and can recollect, the witness must be interviewed as soon possible in isolation. Granted, that this witness’s memory was trashed by what Crump did, but even at that late stage what BDLR failed to establish as background is unfathomable. And as I have written before, I was speechless to learn that Sybrina was sitting next to W8 while a sworn statement was taken from the witness of such potential importance.

The difference is size of the writing on the W8 letter seems to have been added, but is seems to be the same penmanship, and may have been added on at the same time when the letter was completed. The “Exhibit B” is in print and was likely added by someone else.

It would be helpful to have a color copy of the letter, to see if there are different inks if it was written in ink. It seems like pencil.

Also, we have yet to learn the nature of Gutman’s self-professed prior conversations with W8


AND

Quote:
We are whistling in the dark here. We really know very very little about her. We have a couple of recordings, this letter, and a smattering of deduced facts.

What I forgot to mention in the above speculation is that the “letter” does not necessarily include everything she may have known or recalled (without outside influence).

In fact you could interpret the letter as a “de minimus” account, actually designed to minimize what she knows in order to avoid being drawn further into the public arena and in attempt to stay out of the case (for any variety of reasons. We also do not know the influence of her parents or close friends on her decision making.

The writing in the letter seems far more articulate than the mumbling heard in recorded form. Once again, it could be due to extreme reluctance at the situation she found herself in.

Lastly, as to memory, many times a witness will give an account, and then, sometimes later will recall other pertinent details that pop into mind as the memory is further processed in the subconscious. Often these latter recollections (if not contaminated by outside influence) are very helpful.

But the handling of W8 is so unbelievably trashed, the trashers (prosecution) could credibly assert that the witness is useless – by virtue of the prosecution’s own dereliction!


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 5:28 pm 
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Remote wrote:
Seems there was talk of Trayvon "looking into cars" while in this other complex? Don't want to spread false information, but at this point, it's hard to separate fact from fiction regarding this case. :95


Admittedly I haven't followed this case nearly as closely as most. All I've seen on that topic is from the daft post thread here, a nonsense fantasy that included GZ being the leader of a car theft ring and employing TM. Maybe the TM supporters had heard what you remember and were desperately figuring a way to blame GZ. If it helps to track down the info, IIRC it was around page 20 of the daft thread before the current thread. I think it was mid to late January 2013 if that helps to find the info. (I can't access those threads right now.)

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 5:49 pm 
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We can't forget about the forensic evidence involving the phones versus what BDLR is trying to sell as a cheap counterfeit as "phone records" which he references on page 6. I am having trouble copy/pasting so check this post and the couple of following posts by me on the same matter.

https://statelymcdanielmanor.wordpress. ... mment-9484

waltherppk said:
March 30, 2013 at 13:00

On page 6 of BDLR's drunken rant he asserts alleged "facts" about W8 and how the phone records allegedly prove the alleged facts, yet BDLR does not elaborate on what phone records specifically it is that allegedly prove his assertion of alleged "facts". This is not a trivial over generalization and lack of specificity of language to appear in a legal document. Some very specific language should have been used with regards to what it is about the forensic evidence involving the phones for example the ping logs and GPS data and SIM card information about the phones have been confirmed by experts to be consistent with phone billing records and the timeline of events as described by W8, which would tend to prove the veracity of W8's testimony. It seems to be a glaring omission that BDLR would not make such a more specific claim having any legal weight, but would be very vague about exactly what “phone records” are being claimed prove anything. Personally I find this to be suspicious that such a vague statement would be made about the phone records, and it leaves many good questions as to what BDLR is claiming as proof of anything at all.




Edit Rumpole
I am sorry about copy/paste problems
I just did what I had to do to get one of your posts to work.
I simply retyped all the " and '


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 7:20 pm 
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waltherppk wrote:
It seems to be a glaring omission that BDLR would not make such a more specific claim having any legal weight, but would be very vague about exactly what “phone records” are being claimed prove anything. Personally I find this to be suspicious that such a vague statement would be made about the phone records, and it leaves many good questions as to what BDLR is claiming as proof of anything at all.


Bernie seems to claim [insert fervent arm flapping here] that Simple Mobile phone records from an anonymous prepaid cell phone prove the claims of a known age-shifting liar who can't identify her own cell phone carrier. Said known liar herself being anonymous and known only by her nickname, of unknown address and perhaps unseen by all except Sybrina Fulton as of the 3/19 interview. You don't believe that? You must be raaaaycisssssssssssst.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 7:31 pm 
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BdlR said '...Victim and Witness 8's phone records...' This is the first I've heard of Victim 8's phone records. Does BdlR have these; have they been shared with the Defense; have they been made public?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 7:49 pm 
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If the evidence existed and was inculpatory it would have been disclosed very early and very publicly by the State in order to coerce a plea bargain. That disclosure not occurring speaks volumes towards anyone having reasonable belief that the State has nothing to support its prosecution theory but rhetoric and lies.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 9:43 pm 
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Thank you for that insight!

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 10:16 pm 
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It is abundantly clear that the State has no regard whatever for the constitutional rights of the accused who stands accused of a crime yet is not referred to with proper decorum by the state as "the accused murderer" or as "the alleged murderer" or better yet "the defendant" but in nearly all references State prematurely designates the accused or the defendant as being "the murderer" when this is not yet a proven fact. It is a breach of decorum and prejudicial and revealing that the State has no regard whatever for either proper decorum or the law. There is also great emphasis and prejudice by the State continually referring to the deceased as "the victim" or "Victim" instead of "alleged victim". There has been absolutely zero indication that the State respects the law or the rights of the accused and State has at every turn subverted due process by untimely and incomplete discovery or obstructing discovery disclosure completely and then lying about it or refusing to answer questions. The Court that allows this is complicit and is a participant in a criminal conspiracy to violate the rights of the accused to a fair and impartial due process in violation of federal law. The people involved in this evidently believe they have immunity but they don't.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 10:24 pm 
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I was very surprised to see BdlR refer to Zimmerman as a 'murderer'. Prejudicial is a tame description in my book.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 10:47 pm 
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The only reason the State would be exhibiting the breaches of duty, law, and decorum that it has shown is because the State has no fear nor reason to fear any federal involvement and that shows that the Federal checks upon the State which would ordinarily be present have been "deactivated" for lack of a better term. There is a dysfunctional system which allows this kind of thing to occur and it shows that presently the government both State and Federal is effectively "lawless" in its operation. What we are witnessing with the prosecution of George Zimmerman is a racist vendetta being conducted under the guise of law and the government is allowing it to appease a mob. It is NOT the normal operation of law that is occurring, and normal process has not been occurring from the time of the arrest of the accused. It is fully a political prosecution for which there probably does not even exist a prima facie case to be prosecuted.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 10:54 pm 
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From CTH.....


Zimmerman Case – For Those On The Trail of Truths….. Dee Dee Trail (based on letter)
Posted on March 30, 2013 by sundance

It has been noted on multiple GZ talk sites, and we’ve rec’d a few emails about, general mistakes and misperceptions which are leading many people into far afield hypothesis. Especially about the newly released W8 Handwritten statement/letter. Rather than answer each email individually the below information should clarify our research and understanding.

I don’t know if these distractions are intentional, or just because new people are joining in the various discoveries and beginning to “wake up”….

Regardless, If this helps, great. If not… oh well.

#1. Sybrina was not in the same location as Matt Gutman on the 3/19/12 phone call. It appears people are forgetting there is actual ABC footage of that venue (Sybrina’s kitchen?) from the ABC story which ran the following day.

Matt Gutman interviewed Tracy Martin at the kitchen/dining table in what appeared to be a condo. Sybrina was not present. What is certain, was this is the afternoon/evening immediately following the 3.19.12 phone call which led to the 3.20.12 Crump presser at his pals law office office.

#2. The hand written letter was reportedly (by BDLR) given to Sybrina prior to the phone interview. {this I personally doubt – more than likely it was given to Sybrina right after the phone interview and Sybrina was sitting right next to W8 and her mom – most certainly and probably at the same seating}.

Given the explanation afforded to MoM by Dee Dee as to the reasoning for her lies, and knowing where the players were located, this makes the most sense.

#3. Dates ! People are way off on the dates:

  • Friday March 16th - Tripletts office 911 call tapes released to Scheme Team.

  • Saturday March 17th – Supposedly (per initial Crump explanation) the date Tracy discovered DeeDee via checking on-line phone records for account.

  • Sunday March 18th - Supposedly (per initial Crump explanation) the date Tracy called Dee Dee and then called Crump between 4:00pm and 7:00pm.

  • Monday March 19th – The infamous phone interview with W8 was conducted.

  • Tuesday March 20th – The infamous Benjamin Crump “minor child” {*lunch time} press conference.


.....more (comments)
http://theconservativetreehouse.com/201 ... on-letter/

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:10 pm 
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flareon wrote:

It's too bad for her that any normal person would have found "this tragic story" that very night.

No one could have heard what she claims she heard and not try to do something that night ... and they certainly wouldn't have to wait until approached by someone (after the 911 tapes and other information was released) to realize that they was the last person to talk to him alive.

If the statement is all you have to go by then, I am not surprised she was not worried. It was, at most, just a fight. I am not surprised knowing BDLR's philosophy, that you don't do the defense's job for them, that this was not released earlier.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:30 pm 
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liesel wrote:

Admittedly I haven't followed this case nearly as closely as most. All I've seen on that topic is from the daft post thread here, a nonsense fantasy that included GZ being the leader of a car theft ring and employing TM. Maybe the TM supporters had heard what you remember and were desperately figuring a way to blame GZ. If it helps to track down the info, IIRC it was around page 20 of the daft thread before the current thread. I think it was mid to late January 2013 if that helps to find the info. (I can't access those threads right now.)

Hi liesel and :92 !

Good memory! Now that you mention it, I do remember them being scared that it might be true (about Trayvon looking into cars) and they were desperate to minimize, blame GZ or rationalize why that would be. I will take a look around and see what I can find in the previous Daft thread. I can't remember from where they had heard these rumors, but it was enough to shake them up.


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