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George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
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Author:  Rumpole [ Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:37 am ]
Post subject:  George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
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Author:  Rumpole [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
Image
Author:  cherpa1 [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 1:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
Ah yes, the skinny bean pole little boy!
Author:  Rumpole [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 6:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
I assume there is no ruling from Nelson on the State's "Laughing Language Loons" Frye Motion?

I guess she really does live in a "Technology Black Hole" as she claims? :eek

Hard to imagine that anybody living amongst modern technology could not relay a simple ruling via some sort of communication device??? Secure and protected even.

She mentioned "No Fax" which seems bizarre...

If all else fails... perhaps carrier pigeon? Perhaps utilise State's Witness #C42 (Cocky the cockatoo)?

Image "Faaark!..... State's Motion...... faaark!...... granted!....... faaark!........ garanted!"

Image
Author:  Rumpole [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 7:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
I think I need a new word.... I have worn out "travesty" :)

Here we go again... it will be a travesty if Judge Nelson allows the ridiculous "experts" to testify in this case.

EVERYBODY can see they are both shonky.. one of them (at least) looks to be a con-man... IMO

The Voice screaming is clearly GZ. The circumstances are such that it is nuts to consider it would be TM. The circumstances are such that it makes perfect sense that it is GZ.

Even if one, for the sake of the argument, considers the two shonkies alleged results.... They have NOT proved the screaming is TM... they have merely proposed it is "not GZ". Tested a GZ sample and indicated that the scream is "NOT GZ". That is FAR from proving it was TM (according to them). The obvious next step, if they were genuine, would be to investigate a TM voice sample. I am SURE that if they were genuine.. that also would show as NOT the voice. So they would be left with.... NOT GZ AND NOT TM

THAT would be good evidence. It would at least show exactly how good their methodology, equipment, and own listening skills are.

All about as useful as tits on a bull.

They might just as well run a "voice exemplar" from Cocky the cockatoo.

I suspect their method is "no method at all".. it will show "NO MATCH" for any test voice sample.''

SNAKE OIL


In some cases it may not be such a big deal for one side to bring in dubious expert testimony. It can after all be countered by experts from the opposing side.

But here (as West tried to point out to the Dim Judge).. the Prejudicial effect of just uttering this nonsense to the Jury is HUGE. The "bell can not be un-rung" as they say.

West mentioned a law (403 something-or-other??)... IANAL but I suspect that is to do with weighing the probative value against prejudicial nature of evidence (testimony)... Here the probative value is ZERO since it's total crap.. but the prejudicial effect may well be huge. It may imprint a notion on some Jurors that "perhaps" it may have been TM screaming (even though there is still no proof of that) That could be enough to cloud an otherwise crystal clear case of "Self Defence"
Author:  kbp [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
Rumpole wrote:
....Even if one, for the sake of the argument, considers the two shonkies alleged results.... They have NOT proved the screaming is TM... they have merely proposed it is "not GZ". Tested a GZ sample and indicated that the scream is "NOT GZ". That is FAR from proving it was TM (according to them). The obvious next step, if they were genuine, would be to investigate a TM voice sample. I am SURE that if they were genuine.. that also would show as NOT the voice. So they would be left with.... NOT GZ AND NOT TM

Correct me if I am wrong (you're good at it!), but did not Reich opine that portions of the screams were a likely match to Trayvon?
Author:  John_Galt [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
Quote:
Here we go again... it will be a travesty if Judge Nelson allows the ridiculous "experts" to testify in this case.


I think Nelson will permit them to testify. Writing an order preventing them from testifying is easy. Crafting sophistry sufficient to cover their admission would take time.
Author:  John_Galt [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 9:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
Quote:
The Voice screaming is clearly GZ.


Yes.



Quote:
The circumstances are such that it is nuts to consider it would be TM. The circumstances are such that it makes perfect sense that it is GZ.


The circumstances are such that without bogus experts, jury would very likely find that it was GZ screaming, w/o GZ taking the stand.

More and more I am thinking this is a battle about getting GZ on the stand so that BDLR can beat up the ADD and PTSD addled GZ with his prior inconsistent statements.
Author:  kbp [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 9:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
Quote:
Here we go again... it will be a travesty if Judge Nelson allows the ridiculous "experts" to testify in this case.


John_Galt wrote:
I think Nelson will permit them to testify. Writing an order preventing them from testifying is easy. Crafting sophistry sufficient to cover their admission would take time.

There seemed to be quite a few things the 3 defense experts differed on a little, so as I noticed that thoughts of opportunity for that "sophistry" had crossed my mind.

If Bernie gets a favorable ruling, he's stuck with 2 experts that do not appear to blend well, IMO.

It strikes me as Reich checking individual syllables of scattered speech he is working to source individually, while Owen is trying to replicate the syllables a couple times to then toss them together into something like a full sentence to illustrate it did not come from a specific source.

IOW, to me, one is looking to identify separate ingredients that add up to a half a teaspoon, while the other is tossing it together and calling it a full bowl of soup he can identify ...while one of them is also trying to pull a few sides out of it to make it a full meal. Bernie has to select a single chef if he wants to fool the jury, as those two are using different recipes.
Author:  John_Galt [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 9:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
OMFG - all bets off - Nelson acting like a real judge.

http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0613/or ... luding.pdf
Author:  kbp [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 10:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
Rumpole wrote:
....Even if one, for the sake of the argument, considers the two shonkies alleged results.... They have NOT proved the screaming is TM... they have merely proposed it is "not GZ". Tested a GZ sample and indicated that the scream is "NOT GZ". That is FAR from proving it was TM (according to them). The obvious next step, if they were genuine, would be to investigate a TM voice sample. I am SURE that if they were genuine.. that also would show as NOT the voice. So they would be left with.... NOT GZ AND NOT TM

kbp wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong (you're good at it!), but did not Reich opine that portions of the screams were a likely match to Trayvon?


http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0513/05 ... report.pdf
Reich Report:

Image


Now, after all the work to refresh my memory, clip a couple page shots, save to pic host, and share here ...it does not matter anyway!!!

Thanks John!
Author:  kbp [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 10:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
John_Galt wrote:
OMFG - all bets off - Nelson acting like a real judge.

http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0613/or ... luding.pdf


O'Mara: 'Excuse me Ben, I need to interrupt this deposition for a special announcement.'
Author:  taurus [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
John_Galt wrote:
OMFG - all bets off - Nelson acting like a real judge.

http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0613/or ... luding.pdf



Thud...this is a huge hit for the prosecution....I can see Weasel and Bernie now scrambling the Opening statement they were going to present.
Author:  LondoJowo [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
Are there any large bridges in Sanford? The Klingon Weasel Boy may be jumping off one this morning.
Author:  John_Galt [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
KWB may be delighted that he won't have to suborn insanity before a world wide audience.
Author:  kbp [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
I had just joked about Crump in a deposition in a post above. Didn't one attorney, maybe Crumps, ask that Nelson be available when that deposition took place?
Author:  kbp [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 1:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
John's witty remark @ CTH needed an image.


Yeah, the grass stains on Trayvon’s [knees] present a problem without a voodoo expert to testify to “I’m begging you.”
Image


No luck searching for a dawg in a hoodie.
Author:  cherpa1 [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 1:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
kbp wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong (you're good at it!), but did not Reich opine that portions of the screams were a likely match to Trayvon?

"tentatively"
Author:  liesel [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 1:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
Of course I'm happy about this victory for GZ and the rule of law. I can't help also engage in a bit of schadenfreude with regard to the possibly devastating impact this exclusion will have on the ability of Owen to peddle his snake oil in the future. Once an expert has been excluded, it can cause them to never be used again. Any time Owen is proffered as an expert, this exclusion will be brought up, etc.
Author:  jayjerome [ Sat Jun 22, 2013 1:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #7
Wow. Amazing. I thought she was going to allow it.
(glad I was wrong!)
Now it will be contradictory witnesses with differing opinions who was screaming.
That should cancel out the 'screaming' tape.
GZ's chances for acquittal just jumped up twice fold.
And whoever wrote the opinion gets accolades :51 for clear, concise expression of language.
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