Yes but "scuffling" (attacking) some unknown dude is not a smart choice when the law is that people can, and do, carry firearms to defend themselves.

The ONLY reason a person carries a concealed hand gun (legally) is to shoot (and kill) somebody else. (In self defence)

A gun should never be thought of as a thing to wave around and scare people away, or there to fire a "warning shot"

It is there to point and shoot at another person and most likely kill them.

CWP has been deemed to be desirable in Florida... that means it is considered OK to shoot and kill in certain circumstances.

I can't think of more appropriate circumstances that the ones seen in this case.



IF the people of Florida are unhappy with that... they MAY want to consider a law change?

But..... NOT legal action against George Zimmerman under the present laws.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

A 17 year old acts first and thinks secondly! I doubt many 17 year olds even know the laws. Zimmerman may have been within his rights according to law but if he had stayed in his truck and waited for the police-none of this would never have happened. It was an unnecessary death.

Oh, Katt that is plain silly

Sure... GZ could have stayed in his truck, or stayed home, or stayed in bed that morning?

THAT is irrelevant.. LIFE does not have an erase and rewind button.

TM could have walked on home, not gone out in the first place, also stayed in bed that morning etc etc etc.

The circumstances are as they are.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

I seriously doubt that either the Zimmerman family or the Martin family thinks it is plain silly.

The notion of "if only" changing events leading up to something happening is silly.

Life is not like that

GZ DID get out of his truck? GZ did go out to get milk (or whatever) GZ did get out of bed that day.

I have written before... I can imagine doing EXACTLY what GZ did. It is all very normal.

I imagine that GZ does wish he stayed in his truck, or stayed home, or stayed in bed that morning.... I repeat... LIFE is not like that.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

The only thing that would seem to make it more acceptable to me for him to have gotten out of his vehicle is because there had been previous problems with young people in that community. since he was a neighborhood watch person he was trying to find out where the kid was going so he could direct the police. I know they call it profiling but we can't kid ourselves it happens with some of the best of us at times. Now the part after that is what we don't know. Did he go back to his truck and get jumped or did he move ahead and jump Trayvon?

I'd have done EXACTLY the same... it looks like I would have got my head stoved in..... because I don't carry a gun?

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

From the Last Refuge

Detective Chris Serino and ABC’s Matt Gutman BUSTED
Posted on June 26, 2012 by sundancecracker



...more at link
http://theconservativetreehouse.com/201 ... an-busted/

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Rut Roh – Matt Gutman trying a coverup? cuts off twitter feed history ???
Posted on June 26, 2012 by sundancecracker



...more at link
http://theconservativetreehouse.com/201 ... d-history/

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Jane, R, everyone - Hi!
I missed this place sooo much. Off for days .. on with INDIA!
Up and running now! Probably shouldn't write now... so tired.

We need all the facts ... all of us. I do think Prosecution always present what they think happened via evidence. They seem to think that is what to do. That is their pattern, I think - speaking for the victim, giving their side as they see it, from the evidence. People usually want to see the story from the victim's side too.

They said on HLN that Z. had two chances to tell Trayvon WHO he was - The Captain of the Neighborhood Watch. (I only caught the end of it). I think if he did that wouldn't that have de-escalted things - somwhat maybe? T. would know he wasn't a creep, a pervert, or thief wanting to steal his phone, etc. etc.? Some 911 caller heard ANGRY conversation, from one person is that right?

Trayvon was on the phone during the beginning of the physical confrontation with Dee Dee. Z. wasn't on the phone, was he? Why did he hang up? If he didn't want to speak to the dispatcher, (give his location away?), he still could have had the line alive. He said "OK" to -- "You don't have to do that." IF he wanted follow him he might be breathless, and not want the dispatcher to hear him, his breathing?

This should be a very interesting trial ... with all the calls, Z's and the 911 calls. I think they are really good to have. We truly need all the evidence laid out in front of us ... and probably explained in detail by both sides. I hope the FL jury is bright, decent, and fair.

ok ... ready ... NO I'm not ready...exhausted really ... 3 days with India and the Phillipines.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

George Zimmerman: New Reports, New Injury Video
By Jeralyn, Section Crime in the News
Posted on Tue Jun 26, 2012 at 09:33:57 PM EST



The material released today in discovery in the George Zimmerman-Trayvon Martin case includes details previously blacked out in reports released earlier, and a new version of the re-enactment video that includes several minutes at the end in which Zimmerman describes his injuries. Unlike several media reports I've seen, I don't think the new details diminish Zimmerman's self-defense claim.

Exerpt


....more at link
http://www.talkleft.com/story/2012/6/26/223357/828

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

I am going to wait for the true evidence from experts at the trial to really form an opinion. BUT from what we have seen thus far is coming from George alone. I am going to have to admit when I listened to his recounting the chain of events, it sounded to me like he was making things up as he went along. He reminded me of listening to a child telling his/her side of a story.

I do not know if Zimmerman actually felt in fear for his life or he just acted too hastily. What I am quite certain of he did not go out with the intention of stalking down a boy, black or white and shooting him for no reason. My big question still remains the level of threat Trayvon was to George...We cannot all agree with one another but I hope we disagree respectfully.

Katt Hi!

I really don't know what happened either ... we will have to wait for ALL the evidence comes in and be presented at trial I guess.

Yes, that's how I feel... we are hearing George's story. He is the only one left standing. I am always mindful though - beyond this case too - that defendant's statements are always self serving... that's the WAY it IS. Can't be helped. Normal I guess.

But - - I do believe there are always two sides to every story - surely there are.

What I don't understand about me is -- why I continue to have these knawing things going on inside me, that this situation doesn't quite ... pass the "smell test", and that things don't seem *quite* right"?

I do think in such a case like this, a shooting of a kid who turned 17 three weeks previously, who HAD NO obvious weapons or burgulary tools on him - HAS to be examined closely. I know T was 6' tall, but he is still a teen. (Just turned Seven - teen.) Neither boy nor man, they say ...

Was Zimmerman way off base here? Did he over-react? Was he so sick and tired of those A** H***S ALWAYS getting away - and Trayvon paid the price? Was he frustrated too about being rejected from the Police Force? He did lose weight (that is one of the reasons I think he was rejected - not sure if there were more ...), and was taking L.E. courses. He is one determined dude I think.
I believe there are some human beings that do not have some of the inate, natural qualities that would make a good cop. We all know of BULLY cops, crooked cops, etc. Wanting to "do good" HAS to be tempered with caution. After all, one could kill an innocent person.

Zimmerman (The Registered Neighborhood Watch one. It teaches how to de-escalate things, keep peace, calm, what to do and what NOT to do, and above all their on-going reminders at their meetings ... "JUST be our eyes, and call us. WE will take care of it".)

Here I go again ...

R - I so appreciate all you do for us. I do ... you are truly great!

I agree that Z turned himself in, voluntarily. That was good and it really looked good for him. I mean that.

But I also read, when L.E. took his Passport, he applied for and got another one - right away saying --"I lost mine".

Now I believe his confiscated one was going to expire in a month or two, but it is obvious isn't it that L.E. DIDN'T WANT him to have a Passport - and surely he understood that? He tries to be a real insider, hanging around Police Stations, going on "drive alongs" with cops, takes L.E. courses, AND is the son of a Judge, and a Court Worker.) Z is no stranger to the Law. But - he got another one, and held it - secretly. Maybe that's why he sits in jail now? Things like that? I don't know.

It's things like this I believe that keep me wondering about his honesty, stability, morals, etc.
He's no ?

I need a drink - wish I drank. If I keep following cases like this, I just might start!

Prosecutors release George Zimmerman voice samples
By Jeff Weiner and Rene Stutzman, Orlando Sentinel
3:03 p.m. EST, June 27, 2012

Special Prosecutor Angela Corey on Wednesday released two voice samples George Zimmerman gave to authorities.

In them, he can be heard moaning and shouting "Help!" repeatedly.

The samples were presumably meant for audio experts trying to determine whether the voice heard screaming for help in the background of a 911 call belonged to him or 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, the Miami Gardens teenager he killed Feb. 26.

...more at link
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/201 ... io-experts

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Zimmerman reenacts yells heard in 911 call
Compare Zimmerman's reenacted yells to the original yells heard in a 911 call....

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

It is simply ludicrous to imagine the voice yelling for HELP in the background of the 911 call is TM.
Even TM's father, Tracy was sure it was NOT TM......
And it's not..... it is GZ as clear as day.... no doubt at all in my mind.. and no doubt at all in the mind of GZ father..... very clearly GZ.... no doubt at all.

GZ described yelling "help" etc in the reenactment LONG before the 911 calls were released (known about).

It was a stroke of luck that his cries were picked up in the background of one of the calls.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

George Zimmerman asks judge to let him wear street clothes, no chains at bond hearing
By Rene Stutzman, Orlando Sentinel
3:04 p.m. EST, June 27, 2012


There will be news crews there, wrote defense attorney Mark O'Mara, and "the manner in which Mr. Zimmerman is portrayed by the media will have a tremendous impact on his ability to receive a fair trial."

Before Zimmerman's last bail hearing April 20, O'Mara made the same request. Circuit Judge Kenneth Lester Jr. agreed to let the defendant wear street clothes instead of a Seminole County Jail jumpsuit but insisted that he be in chains.

Zimmerman appeared in a blue suit that was at least two sizes too big with his hands cuffed to a chain around his waist and his ankles shackled.

In his motion, O'Mara wrote that at Friday's hearing, the chains are unnecessary. Zimmerman has twice surrendered to authorities when he knew he was going to jail.

....more at link
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/201 ... et-clothes

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

I think it might be Z yelling Help ... not sure.

Who is WAILING though? Could that be another voice? Trayvon? I don't know.

That sounded like a kid ... maybe the HELP is a man? Both yelling?

Jane VM is going to have some new things on her program - in a few minutes.

Z. bullied a person at work. They filed a Complaint against him... not sure if they even quit.
Coming on in a few minutes... She is on HLN.