@AlexCrawfordSky
Nel suggested #oscarpistorius paid 6000 SA Rand every month to Reeva's parents” That's about £350

No detail about just how long OP monthly payments have been sent to the Steenkamp parents. First time we've heard of this

It seems Vergeer is suggesting that the civil action (Steenkamps were pursuing this before trial) has been dropped

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Barry Bateman@barrybateman
Nel places it on record that the monthly money paid to the Steenkamps “will be paid back to the accused, every cent”

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Nel places it on record that the monthly money paid to the Steenkamps “will be paid back to the accused, every cent”


IMO

What? This is so bizarre. I haven't read or watched anything yet but SA law must be very different than US law. It was my understanding that there was already a settlement reached before the trial, but maybe I am remembering wrong.

I know that because of Reeva's horrific and tragic death she has been elevated to a celebrity status that she did not hold, the truth is that IMO her greatest claim to fame was her association with Oscar. She was on one reality show (I think she was the first person voted off), she was a cover girl for a magazine that was geared toward gentleman and showing scantily clad pretty woman (one of her friends even said that she was looking at moving to more reputable sources) and I believe she became spokeswoman for a brand, maybe Avon? I am not trying to speak any ill of her, but the cold facts are that a short woman at the age of 30 is simply not going to become a super model raking in huge modeling fees. I can't imagine what is going on, she didn't leave behind dependent children, she left behind parents, this is all very odd to me.

Which is all not to say that I don't think that Oscar should justly pay a settlement for his negligently killing Reeva, but I think he has already done so and it seems that a monthly allowance was part of that settlement.

Off to watch for a little bit.

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If your mind is agitated you will find agitation everywhere. Where else will you find peace if not within you? __ Papaji

Aavi it appears that Nel is quite accustom to bullying his way to putting his words in witnesses mouths. If he doesn't succeed at that he seems to simply state Nel's truth as an unassailable fact. I have to say that I laughed out loud when Nel ominously warned that he "marked" certain things in his notes. Nel has made marks and puffs his chest out about it. What a goof.

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If your mind is agitated you will find agitation everywhere. Where else will you find peace if not within you? __ Papaji

It seems that way Rumpole.

The stance of Reeva's family appears to be changing from one of 'we'll remain impartial and let the court do their job to search for the truth' to one where they're not entirely happy that he hasn't been convicted of murder with intent.

I don't really have a problem with them accepting monetary help, but I was under the impression that they were going to be accepting of the verdict whatever the outcome. That was admirable, but to take some form of payment and then declare just prior to sentencing that they will be paying it back can only suggest that they want to influence the eventual decision. Whether this was instigated by Nel and his cronies or is their own doing is anyone's guess. One thing for certain is that the timing is no coincidence.

Nel again did himself no favours with his bully-boy tactics. It defies belief that the man can spend half an hour trying to convince the court that there really is no difference between the requirements and vulnerability a double leg amputee vs an able bodied person in a prison environment. I thought Masipa was extremely patient with the arrogant sods method of questioning today - far more patient than I could have been.


NEL

Hi Guys.
One worry I had last night was that Masipa admonished the WITNESS to answer Nel's questions/line of questioning. It seemed to me at the time that Nel had "left the reservation". Stamping his feet , shouting "You are WRONG!" at the witness. Again concocting a hypothetical version and demanding that witness consider this construct, rather than reality. I would have thought NEL needed to be told that he was off in the Twilight Zone. He used his old trick of threatening current witness with what his witness would say in the future. THAT is clearly NUTS. Who is to say Nel's "clairvoyant hearsay" is what his witness will in fact say? How can it be put out there by Nel as a fact when it has not yet even been uttered, let alone questioned and cross-examined. I really do SMH a lot at the SA way.
Nel actually badgered the witness repeatedly with questions in the context "What if..." What if Oscar HAD ben found guilty of Dolus Directus!! Eh? Nel tried to force the witness to say that OP would be sent to prison if he had been found guilty of Nel's imaginary crime. He just will not absorb the reality of the verdict NOT GUILTY. Nel is trying to put a fantasy world where OP really should have been found guilty, and so should get almost same punishment now. Where SA prisons are new age, warm friendly places...ready and able to cater for disabled prisoners.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

I’m not sure who Nel is questioning in the portion I am watching but it sounds like Oscar’s manager?


Nel asked why the State held any responsibility for Oscar’s position.

Why would the witness not simply say that the State promoting a unverifiable narrative about a screaming fight and the State’s ridiculous charge of premeditated murder did have a negative effect on Oscar’s career regardless of Oscar’s negligence resulting in the death of Reeva.

I’m sure if Roux thinks clarification is needed he will cover it in his summation.

Nel is a top notch prosecutor ?

Does Nel really think that going over Oscar’s charity work with a fine tooth comb is going to have a positive bearing on aggravating circumstances? All Nel is achieving is illustrating that Oscar, as all celebrities benefitted his public image by doing charity work. Many celebrities do not take part in any charity work. And the fact that Oscar did not keep certain money that he was paid but turned around and donated it to various causes is further evidence of Oscar’s bad character? Can Nel possibly be so dull as to think that nit picking at Oscar’s charitable works is going to get a positive tick in the bad character box.

Judge Masipa sees things in simple legal terms, charitable work is a tick in the box of good character, for some reason this simple point is lost on Nel. It seems Nel is trying to speculate as to a nefarious reason as to why Oscar was involved in charity. We already know how the judge feels about speculation

There has got to be better ways for him to spend the State’s money.

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If your mind is agitated you will find agitation everywhere. Where else will you find peace if not within you? __ Papaji

Ah 4 1/2 minutes and a smile I'm sure that went over like a dagger straight through the heart of the conspirators.

I do think that Masipa has Nel's number and is none too fond of his shenanigans.

_________________
If your mind is agitated you will find agitation everywhere. Where else will you find peace if not within you? __ Papaji

Oscar Pistorius Has Been Paying Steenkamp Family Since the Shooting
Oct 14, 2014, 9:38 AM ET
By ABC NEWS via Good Morning America

Convicted paralympian Oscar Pistorius has been making financial payments to the family of Reeva Steenkamp, the girlfriend he killed last Valentine's Day, since shortly after the fatal shooting and he intends to set up a trust fund for the family once the sentencing is over, according to testimony at his sentencing trial today.

The financial revelation came as a probation officer warned the court that if the legless Pistorius is sentenced to prison he would be vulnerable to attacks by other inmates, particularly if his prosthetic legs were taken away from him.

Probation officer Annette Vergeer was the second law enforcement official to suggest Pistorius be spared prison despite being convicted of culpable homicide - the equivalent of manslaughter - in Steenkamp's death. On Monday, a corrections social worker urged the court to sentence Pistorius to three years of house arrest along with community service.

Pistorius, a champion sprinter known as the Blade Runner for his prosthetic blades, could be sentenced to as much as 15 years in prison.

Vergeer also told the court that Pistorius has been making monthly payments of $530 (6,000 Rand) a month to the Steenkamp family since March 2013, one month after their daughter's death

The probation officer said the Pistorius sold his car for about $34,000 (375,000 Rand), but the Steenkamps rejected the money, Vergeer said.

"Mrs. Steenkamp said she did not want blood money," prosecutor Gerrien Nel said. Nel also said that the Steenkamps intended to repay the money from the monthly payments to Pistorius.

....More at link
http://abcnews.go.com/International/osc ... d=26175137

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Steenkamps come across as VERY conniving!

They lost my vote

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Even in tv interviews, they never once alluded to receiving such payments.

I realize SA trials are very different from what we are used to, but this mini trial pre sentencing is farcical.

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Since we are destined to live out our lives in the prison of our minds, our one duty is to furnish it well~Peter Ustinov

I agree Wroughead.

Seems to me Nel is giving evidence himself, about ACTS etc.. then bashing witness with stuff that is not her job.

And... bringing up a past case that she did probation report on is surely inadmissible? VERY selective clearly one case in 28 years where custodial sentence perp went out and did bad things. A serial sex offender to start with? hardly relevant.

And WHY is Nel allowed to use "clairvoyant hearsay" of what HIS witness will say (if called and IF asked right questions and give answers Nel predicts)????

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

We are baffled by this RT, even by SA standards that we have witnessed during this face of a trial, Nel's moves cause me great concern - he often switches subjects in the middle of questions to witnesses, this has become a tactic of his - but it's purpose overall, is lost on me - I also think it is now time that the judge simply said 'right enough, I move to sentence'.

Nel now saying he wants to break for lunch as he needs an hour to go over his next witness - suspect 4 witnesses oh geez give me strength.

_________________
Since we are destined to live out our lives in the prison of our minds, our one duty is to furnish it well~Peter Ustinov

How often can I say how nasty and vindictive Nel is. He clearly wants OP to SUFFER.. it seems personal with Nel. To hell with rehabilitation etc..
Nel is Biblical lol
An eye for an eye.
Moreover he STILL has not got the memo that he LOST his case. OP is innocent of what Nel put as his case.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

And... statement from Steenkamps confirms my (now) dislike of them
In financial difficulty after Reeva killed??? Why? Were they living off her earnings? She was only a wannabe celebrity.. any earning could have vanished in a flash. One bad TV appearance could see her out of favour.
Seems to me Oscar was MORE than compassionate in offering them money.. regular and lump sum. The fact that it was HE wo wanted it kept confidential indicate he was not being self-serving.
They took the damned money.. now they say its "blood money? Give me a break.

OP should think himself very lucky he does not have Steenkamps as in-laws.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

I couldn't have put it better myself RT. In the beginning I felt grieved for Reeva's parents, but not as time has gone on, and more so since we've heard of the other stuff.

You're right, she was hardly a big earner, though perhaps that was still to come, but she didn't owe her parents a living, often people who do well will send money home to their less well off parents, but that's not what the case is here - frankly I'm disgusted by this.

_________________
Since we are destined to live out our lives in the prison of our minds, our one duty is to furnish it well~Peter Ustinov

Oh pleasssssssssssssse spare us the Reeva as a child stuff!

What has all of this witness's chatter got to do prey tell, with sentencing phase of this trial - I'm once again baffled. We've learned about these people that they loved animals - like me and millions of others, they took care of them, and Reeva was something of an angel around animals - which I like, but that's all way back in time, why does Nel have to put the world through this, not to mention OP and his family.

_________________
Since we are destined to live out our lives in the prison of our minds, our one duty is to furnish it well~Peter Ustinov

I hope Barry Roux gives Nel a lesson in "Class" there is no point in him questioning the family history etc.

"No Questions M'Lady" would show class and put Nel to shame.. but Nel is too nasty and stupid to notice.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Interesting interview with the Steemkamp’s attorney.



The attorney claims that the Steempkamps wanted to make the payments public but Oscar wanted it to be private. The attorney also said about accepting the money that “ Their minds haven’t changed their circumstances have changed.”

A reporter asked “Why did their circumstances change” here the attorney seems to start to walk away and clearly looks uncomfortable, but says “I made some deals for them.”

Also asked “So that was part of the conditions to keep it private” and the attorney answers no, there were no conditions, it was all word of mouth. Word of mouth contracts can have conditions surely an attorney knows this.



I do know that it has been stated on numerous occasions that Reeva sometimes finically helped her parents so it seems they were in finical stress even before her death.

Now equally intriguing is Mrs. Steemkamp’s insistence that Nel call it blood money, so much so that Nel announced that “blood money” was Mrs. Steemkamps term, but not for the monthly payment but for an offer of a large lump sum payment from Oscar. This is bizarre, money from Oscar that comes as a monthly payment is simply a loan (I do not believe Oscar ever intended to be paid back) but money given all at once is “blood money” ? Eh? That is so convoluted I can't wrap my head around it.

And now the Steemkamps are in the position to pay Oscar back. This perked my brain also. It seems the Steempkamps have been doing "for pay" interviews.

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/ ... ederated=1

I believe one report had them demanding 500,000 (Sorry I cant remember if it was rand of $) for an interview.

And they were in negotiations before the trial for a monetary settlement from Oscar.

http://www.timeslive.co.za/local/2014/0 ... -pistorius

So as uncomfortable as it may make some folks the Steemkamps are profiting off of the death of their daughter. Would they rather have their daughter than the monetary gain, the answer is of course yes, but that does not change the fact that they have benefitted finically.

It is curious that the time for the payments was to be 18 months and 18 months later it is being made public.

Another curiosity is that it currently is being mentioned that the Steemkamps would not now pursue a civil case against Oscar. I believe that a lump sum was settled upon before the trial commenced and part of the settlement was the 6000 rand monthly for 18 months. I don’t believe it was ever to be repaid. I believe part of the settlement is that it is sealed and the details are to remain between the parties. In my mind nothing else makes sense.

I still feel very sorry for the Steemkamps and cannot imagine their pain.

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If your mind is agitated you will find agitation everywhere. Where else will you find peace if not within you? __ Papaji